Are prime numbers really random?












11












$begingroup$


While practicing to code for my college course I stumbled upon this and would like to know if this is something new or significant as I haven't found anything resembling it on the internet.



$ p_1, p_2, ..., p_n = text{consecutive prime numbers starting from 2} \$



$ q_1 = p_2p_3...p_n \
q_2 = p_1p_3...p_n \
... \
q_n = p_1p_2...p_{n-1} \$



$ r_1 in {1, ..., p_1-1} \
... \
r_n in {1, ..., p_n-1} \$



$ s= p_1p_2...p_n \$



$ x equiv q_1r_1+...+q_nr_n :text{mod}: s \$



$ x_2 = text{the second smallest congruence} \
text{All congruences less than } x_2^2 text{ are also every prime number between } p_n text{ and } x_2^2 \$



$ text{example:} \$



$ p_1, p_2, ..., p_n = 2, 3, 5 \$



$ q_1 = 3cdot5 = 15 \
q_2 = 2cdot5 = 10 \
q_3 = 2cdot3 = 6 \$



$ r_1 in {1} \
r_2 in {1, 2} \
r_3 in {1, 2, 3, 4} \$



$ s = 2cdot3cdot5=30 \$



$ x_2 equiv 7 equiv 15cdot1 +10cdot1 +6cdot2 :text{mod}: 30 \
7^2 = 49 \$



$ text{The full sequence of primes is clearly not random.} \$



$ 0 \
color{blue}{1 equiv 31 equiv 15cdot1 +10cdot1 +6cdot1 :text{mod}: 30} \
1 \
2 \
3 \
4 \
color{red}{5} \$



$ 6 \
color{blue}{7 equiv 37 equiv 15cdot1 +10cdot1 +6cdot2 :text{mod}: 30} \
8 \
9 \
10 \
color{red}{11 equiv 41 equiv 15cdot1 +10cdot2 +6cdot1 :text{mod}: 30} \$



$ 12 \
color{blue}{13 equiv 43 equiv 15cdot1 +10cdot1 +6cdot3 :text{mod}: 30} \
14 \
15 \
16 \
color{red}{17 equiv 47 equiv 15cdot1 +10cdot2 +6cdot2 :text{mod}: 30} \$



$ 18 \
color{blue}{19 equiv 15cdot1 +10cdot1 +6cdot4 :text{mod}: 30} \
20 \
21 \
22 \
color{red}{23 equiv 15cdot1 +10cdot2 +6cdot3 :text{mod}: 30} \$



$ 24 \
color{blue}{25} \
26 \
27 \
28 \
color{red}{29 equiv 15cdot1 +10cdot2 +6cdot4 :text{mod}: 30} \$










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  • 1




    $begingroup$
    Just one question, what do you mean with second smallest congruence?
    $endgroup$
    – Stan Tendijck
    2 hours ago










  • $begingroup$
    @StanTendijck um the second smallest x
    $endgroup$
    – user644904
    2 hours ago








  • 1




    $begingroup$
    @user644904 Pretty interesting observation in my opinion.
    $endgroup$
    – Larry
    2 hours ago








  • 1




    $begingroup$
    I am going to code it up. I'll get back to you in approximately 15 minutes.
    $endgroup$
    – Stan Tendijck
    2 hours ago






  • 1




    $begingroup$
    I believe that this can be setup a bit more cleanly: Let $p_i$ denote the $i$-th prime. For a particular $n$, define $s:=p_1p_2cdots p_n$ and $q_i:=s/p_i$ for $i=1,2,ldots,n$. Let $x_2$ be the second-smallest member of the set $$S = left{sum_{i=1}^n q_i r_i bmod s;middle|; 1 leq r_i < p_i right}$$ From there, you seem to be conjecturing that the members of $S$ in some range are exactly the primes in that range, but I'm not entirely clear on the formulation.
    $endgroup$
    – Blue
    31 mins ago


















11












$begingroup$


While practicing to code for my college course I stumbled upon this and would like to know if this is something new or significant as I haven't found anything resembling it on the internet.



$ p_1, p_2, ..., p_n = text{consecutive prime numbers starting from 2} \$



$ q_1 = p_2p_3...p_n \
q_2 = p_1p_3...p_n \
... \
q_n = p_1p_2...p_{n-1} \$



$ r_1 in {1, ..., p_1-1} \
... \
r_n in {1, ..., p_n-1} \$



$ s= p_1p_2...p_n \$



$ x equiv q_1r_1+...+q_nr_n :text{mod}: s \$



$ x_2 = text{the second smallest congruence} \
text{All congruences less than } x_2^2 text{ are also every prime number between } p_n text{ and } x_2^2 \$



$ text{example:} \$



$ p_1, p_2, ..., p_n = 2, 3, 5 \$



$ q_1 = 3cdot5 = 15 \
q_2 = 2cdot5 = 10 \
q_3 = 2cdot3 = 6 \$



$ r_1 in {1} \
r_2 in {1, 2} \
r_3 in {1, 2, 3, 4} \$



$ s = 2cdot3cdot5=30 \$



$ x_2 equiv 7 equiv 15cdot1 +10cdot1 +6cdot2 :text{mod}: 30 \
7^2 = 49 \$



$ text{The full sequence of primes is clearly not random.} \$



$ 0 \
color{blue}{1 equiv 31 equiv 15cdot1 +10cdot1 +6cdot1 :text{mod}: 30} \
1 \
2 \
3 \
4 \
color{red}{5} \$



$ 6 \
color{blue}{7 equiv 37 equiv 15cdot1 +10cdot1 +6cdot2 :text{mod}: 30} \
8 \
9 \
10 \
color{red}{11 equiv 41 equiv 15cdot1 +10cdot2 +6cdot1 :text{mod}: 30} \$



$ 12 \
color{blue}{13 equiv 43 equiv 15cdot1 +10cdot1 +6cdot3 :text{mod}: 30} \
14 \
15 \
16 \
color{red}{17 equiv 47 equiv 15cdot1 +10cdot2 +6cdot2 :text{mod}: 30} \$



$ 18 \
color{blue}{19 equiv 15cdot1 +10cdot1 +6cdot4 :text{mod}: 30} \
20 \
21 \
22 \
color{red}{23 equiv 15cdot1 +10cdot2 +6cdot3 :text{mod}: 30} \$



$ 24 \
color{blue}{25} \
26 \
27 \
28 \
color{red}{29 equiv 15cdot1 +10cdot2 +6cdot4 :text{mod}: 30} \$










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New contributor




user644904 is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
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  • 1




    $begingroup$
    Just one question, what do you mean with second smallest congruence?
    $endgroup$
    – Stan Tendijck
    2 hours ago










  • $begingroup$
    @StanTendijck um the second smallest x
    $endgroup$
    – user644904
    2 hours ago








  • 1




    $begingroup$
    @user644904 Pretty interesting observation in my opinion.
    $endgroup$
    – Larry
    2 hours ago








  • 1




    $begingroup$
    I am going to code it up. I'll get back to you in approximately 15 minutes.
    $endgroup$
    – Stan Tendijck
    2 hours ago






  • 1




    $begingroup$
    I believe that this can be setup a bit more cleanly: Let $p_i$ denote the $i$-th prime. For a particular $n$, define $s:=p_1p_2cdots p_n$ and $q_i:=s/p_i$ for $i=1,2,ldots,n$. Let $x_2$ be the second-smallest member of the set $$S = left{sum_{i=1}^n q_i r_i bmod s;middle|; 1 leq r_i < p_i right}$$ From there, you seem to be conjecturing that the members of $S$ in some range are exactly the primes in that range, but I'm not entirely clear on the formulation.
    $endgroup$
    – Blue
    31 mins ago
















11












11








11


11



$begingroup$


While practicing to code for my college course I stumbled upon this and would like to know if this is something new or significant as I haven't found anything resembling it on the internet.



$ p_1, p_2, ..., p_n = text{consecutive prime numbers starting from 2} \$



$ q_1 = p_2p_3...p_n \
q_2 = p_1p_3...p_n \
... \
q_n = p_1p_2...p_{n-1} \$



$ r_1 in {1, ..., p_1-1} \
... \
r_n in {1, ..., p_n-1} \$



$ s= p_1p_2...p_n \$



$ x equiv q_1r_1+...+q_nr_n :text{mod}: s \$



$ x_2 = text{the second smallest congruence} \
text{All congruences less than } x_2^2 text{ are also every prime number between } p_n text{ and } x_2^2 \$



$ text{example:} \$



$ p_1, p_2, ..., p_n = 2, 3, 5 \$



$ q_1 = 3cdot5 = 15 \
q_2 = 2cdot5 = 10 \
q_3 = 2cdot3 = 6 \$



$ r_1 in {1} \
r_2 in {1, 2} \
r_3 in {1, 2, 3, 4} \$



$ s = 2cdot3cdot5=30 \$



$ x_2 equiv 7 equiv 15cdot1 +10cdot1 +6cdot2 :text{mod}: 30 \
7^2 = 49 \$



$ text{The full sequence of primes is clearly not random.} \$



$ 0 \
color{blue}{1 equiv 31 equiv 15cdot1 +10cdot1 +6cdot1 :text{mod}: 30} \
1 \
2 \
3 \
4 \
color{red}{5} \$



$ 6 \
color{blue}{7 equiv 37 equiv 15cdot1 +10cdot1 +6cdot2 :text{mod}: 30} \
8 \
9 \
10 \
color{red}{11 equiv 41 equiv 15cdot1 +10cdot2 +6cdot1 :text{mod}: 30} \$



$ 12 \
color{blue}{13 equiv 43 equiv 15cdot1 +10cdot1 +6cdot3 :text{mod}: 30} \
14 \
15 \
16 \
color{red}{17 equiv 47 equiv 15cdot1 +10cdot2 +6cdot2 :text{mod}: 30} \$



$ 18 \
color{blue}{19 equiv 15cdot1 +10cdot1 +6cdot4 :text{mod}: 30} \
20 \
21 \
22 \
color{red}{23 equiv 15cdot1 +10cdot2 +6cdot3 :text{mod}: 30} \$



$ 24 \
color{blue}{25} \
26 \
27 \
28 \
color{red}{29 equiv 15cdot1 +10cdot2 +6cdot4 :text{mod}: 30} \$










share|cite|improve this question









New contributor




user644904 is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
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$endgroup$




While practicing to code for my college course I stumbled upon this and would like to know if this is something new or significant as I haven't found anything resembling it on the internet.



$ p_1, p_2, ..., p_n = text{consecutive prime numbers starting from 2} \$



$ q_1 = p_2p_3...p_n \
q_2 = p_1p_3...p_n \
... \
q_n = p_1p_2...p_{n-1} \$



$ r_1 in {1, ..., p_1-1} \
... \
r_n in {1, ..., p_n-1} \$



$ s= p_1p_2...p_n \$



$ x equiv q_1r_1+...+q_nr_n :text{mod}: s \$



$ x_2 = text{the second smallest congruence} \
text{All congruences less than } x_2^2 text{ are also every prime number between } p_n text{ and } x_2^2 \$



$ text{example:} \$



$ p_1, p_2, ..., p_n = 2, 3, 5 \$



$ q_1 = 3cdot5 = 15 \
q_2 = 2cdot5 = 10 \
q_3 = 2cdot3 = 6 \$



$ r_1 in {1} \
r_2 in {1, 2} \
r_3 in {1, 2, 3, 4} \$



$ s = 2cdot3cdot5=30 \$



$ x_2 equiv 7 equiv 15cdot1 +10cdot1 +6cdot2 :text{mod}: 30 \
7^2 = 49 \$



$ text{The full sequence of primes is clearly not random.} \$



$ 0 \
color{blue}{1 equiv 31 equiv 15cdot1 +10cdot1 +6cdot1 :text{mod}: 30} \
1 \
2 \
3 \
4 \
color{red}{5} \$



$ 6 \
color{blue}{7 equiv 37 equiv 15cdot1 +10cdot1 +6cdot2 :text{mod}: 30} \
8 \
9 \
10 \
color{red}{11 equiv 41 equiv 15cdot1 +10cdot2 +6cdot1 :text{mod}: 30} \$



$ 12 \
color{blue}{13 equiv 43 equiv 15cdot1 +10cdot1 +6cdot3 :text{mod}: 30} \
14 \
15 \
16 \
color{red}{17 equiv 47 equiv 15cdot1 +10cdot2 +6cdot2 :text{mod}: 30} \$



$ 18 \
color{blue}{19 equiv 15cdot1 +10cdot1 +6cdot4 :text{mod}: 30} \
20 \
21 \
22 \
color{red}{23 equiv 15cdot1 +10cdot2 +6cdot3 :text{mod}: 30} \$



$ 24 \
color{blue}{25} \
26 \
27 \
28 \
color{red}{29 equiv 15cdot1 +10cdot2 +6cdot4 :text{mod}: 30} \$







prime-numbers modular-arithmetic






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edited 23 mins ago







user644904













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asked 2 hours ago









user644904user644904

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564




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  • 1




    $begingroup$
    Just one question, what do you mean with second smallest congruence?
    $endgroup$
    – Stan Tendijck
    2 hours ago










  • $begingroup$
    @StanTendijck um the second smallest x
    $endgroup$
    – user644904
    2 hours ago








  • 1




    $begingroup$
    @user644904 Pretty interesting observation in my opinion.
    $endgroup$
    – Larry
    2 hours ago








  • 1




    $begingroup$
    I am going to code it up. I'll get back to you in approximately 15 minutes.
    $endgroup$
    – Stan Tendijck
    2 hours ago






  • 1




    $begingroup$
    I believe that this can be setup a bit more cleanly: Let $p_i$ denote the $i$-th prime. For a particular $n$, define $s:=p_1p_2cdots p_n$ and $q_i:=s/p_i$ for $i=1,2,ldots,n$. Let $x_2$ be the second-smallest member of the set $$S = left{sum_{i=1}^n q_i r_i bmod s;middle|; 1 leq r_i < p_i right}$$ From there, you seem to be conjecturing that the members of $S$ in some range are exactly the primes in that range, but I'm not entirely clear on the formulation.
    $endgroup$
    – Blue
    31 mins ago
















  • 1




    $begingroup$
    Just one question, what do you mean with second smallest congruence?
    $endgroup$
    – Stan Tendijck
    2 hours ago










  • $begingroup$
    @StanTendijck um the second smallest x
    $endgroup$
    – user644904
    2 hours ago








  • 1




    $begingroup$
    @user644904 Pretty interesting observation in my opinion.
    $endgroup$
    – Larry
    2 hours ago








  • 1




    $begingroup$
    I am going to code it up. I'll get back to you in approximately 15 minutes.
    $endgroup$
    – Stan Tendijck
    2 hours ago






  • 1




    $begingroup$
    I believe that this can be setup a bit more cleanly: Let $p_i$ denote the $i$-th prime. For a particular $n$, define $s:=p_1p_2cdots p_n$ and $q_i:=s/p_i$ for $i=1,2,ldots,n$. Let $x_2$ be the second-smallest member of the set $$S = left{sum_{i=1}^n q_i r_i bmod s;middle|; 1 leq r_i < p_i right}$$ From there, you seem to be conjecturing that the members of $S$ in some range are exactly the primes in that range, but I'm not entirely clear on the formulation.
    $endgroup$
    – Blue
    31 mins ago










1




1




$begingroup$
Just one question, what do you mean with second smallest congruence?
$endgroup$
– Stan Tendijck
2 hours ago




$begingroup$
Just one question, what do you mean with second smallest congruence?
$endgroup$
– Stan Tendijck
2 hours ago












$begingroup$
@StanTendijck um the second smallest x
$endgroup$
– user644904
2 hours ago






$begingroup$
@StanTendijck um the second smallest x
$endgroup$
– user644904
2 hours ago






1




1




$begingroup$
@user644904 Pretty interesting observation in my opinion.
$endgroup$
– Larry
2 hours ago






$begingroup$
@user644904 Pretty interesting observation in my opinion.
$endgroup$
– Larry
2 hours ago






1




1




$begingroup$
I am going to code it up. I'll get back to you in approximately 15 minutes.
$endgroup$
– Stan Tendijck
2 hours ago




$begingroup$
I am going to code it up. I'll get back to you in approximately 15 minutes.
$endgroup$
– Stan Tendijck
2 hours ago




1




1




$begingroup$
I believe that this can be setup a bit more cleanly: Let $p_i$ denote the $i$-th prime. For a particular $n$, define $s:=p_1p_2cdots p_n$ and $q_i:=s/p_i$ for $i=1,2,ldots,n$. Let $x_2$ be the second-smallest member of the set $$S = left{sum_{i=1}^n q_i r_i bmod s;middle|; 1 leq r_i < p_i right}$$ From there, you seem to be conjecturing that the members of $S$ in some range are exactly the primes in that range, but I'm not entirely clear on the formulation.
$endgroup$
– Blue
31 mins ago






$begingroup$
I believe that this can be setup a bit more cleanly: Let $p_i$ denote the $i$-th prime. For a particular $n$, define $s:=p_1p_2cdots p_n$ and $q_i:=s/p_i$ for $i=1,2,ldots,n$. Let $x_2$ be the second-smallest member of the set $$S = left{sum_{i=1}^n q_i r_i bmod s;middle|; 1 leq r_i < p_i right}$$ From there, you seem to be conjecturing that the members of $S$ in some range are exactly the primes in that range, but I'm not entirely clear on the formulation.
$endgroup$
– Blue
31 mins ago












2 Answers
2






active

oldest

votes


















1












$begingroup$

Interesting that you marked 25, which is not a prime, similar to 6x+1 and 6x-1, which means it's not a primality test, but still quite interesting.






share|cite|improve this answer











$endgroup$













  • $begingroup$
    Yeah, but I can't comment (need 50 reputation), so I posted it here.
    $endgroup$
    – James
    1 hour ago










  • $begingroup$
    Its not a primality test
    $endgroup$
    – user644904
    57 mins ago










  • $begingroup$
    I didn't say you meant it to be, I'm just pointing out it's not unique to only prime numbers.
    $endgroup$
    – James
    54 mins ago












  • $begingroup$
    Yes you're correct
    $endgroup$
    – user644904
    53 mins ago






  • 2




    $begingroup$
    If it was unique to prime numbers, then this would be ground-breaking.
    $endgroup$
    – James
    44 mins ago



















1












$begingroup$

I had to say, I was suspicious when I read the question but I coded up the problem and up to at least $n=10$ it definitely works.



Edit: I have an idea of how this is working and why it is working. We first prove that our sum can never be divided by $p_i$ for $i$ between $1$ and $n$.



To that end, let's first forget about the modulo $p_1p_2cdots p_n$ term. Note that $q_i$ is not divisible by $p_i$. Moreover, $r_i$ is not divisible by $p_i$ and all the other $q_i$s are divisible by $p_i$. Hence, the sum $r_1q_1 + cdots + r_n q_n$ can never be divisible by $p_i$. Adding a multiple of $p_1cdots p_n$ (which is divisible by $p_i$) doesn't change this fact. Hence, $$r_1 q_1 + cdots + r_n q_nmod (p_1cdots p_n)$$
is at least not divisible by any of the first $n$ primes $p_1$, $p_2$, $dots$ ,$p_n$. Now, the question remains: might it be divisible by $p_{n+1}$ for example? We cannot exclude this, but if we require the sum to be close to $(p_1 p_2cdots p_n)$, it might work!



Now, let's study $x_2$ it seems that we can always make a combination such that $$ r_1 q_1 + cdots + r_n q_n = 1mod (p_1p_2cdots p_n) $$
and it seems that we can always make a combination such that
$$ r_1 q_1 + cdots + r_n q_n = p_{n+1}mod (p_1p_2cdots p_n). $$



Now, under the assumption that above assertion holds, it is not too difficult to finish the proof. So, let $s = r_1 q_1 + cdots + r_n q_nmod (p_1p_2cdots p_n)$ such that $s< p_{n+1}^2$ and let's assume it is composite. We have proven above that $s$ is not divisible by $p_1, p_2, dots, p_n$. This means that the first candidate prime factor is actually $geq p_{n+1}$. However, since $s$ is composite, it has a second prime factor and this also needs to be $geq p_{n+1}$. Thus $sgeq p_{n+1}^2$ which is a contradiction.



The only part that I cannot prove is the existence of certain sequences $(r_1,dots,r_n)$ such that the above congruences hold. I believe it is possible that there exist some fancy number theory that can be applied here to complete this proof. I, just a statistician, can give you the particular combinations up to $n=10$ (they do not seem to follow a certain pattern)



Summarizing I have proven the validity of the assertion in the above under the following assumption. For all $ninmathbb{N}$, there exist sequences $(r_1,dots,r_n)$ and $(r_1',dots,r_n')$ such that
$$ r_1 q_1 + cdots + r_n q_n = 1mod p_1p_2cdots p_n $$
and
$$ r_1' q_1 + cdots + r_n' q_n = p_{n+1}mod p_1p_2cdots p_n. $$






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$endgroup$













  • $begingroup$
    Thanks for the verification
    $endgroup$
    – user644904
    56 mins ago











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2 Answers
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active

oldest

votes








2 Answers
2






active

oldest

votes









active

oldest

votes






active

oldest

votes









1












$begingroup$

Interesting that you marked 25, which is not a prime, similar to 6x+1 and 6x-1, which means it's not a primality test, but still quite interesting.






share|cite|improve this answer











$endgroup$













  • $begingroup$
    Yeah, but I can't comment (need 50 reputation), so I posted it here.
    $endgroup$
    – James
    1 hour ago










  • $begingroup$
    Its not a primality test
    $endgroup$
    – user644904
    57 mins ago










  • $begingroup$
    I didn't say you meant it to be, I'm just pointing out it's not unique to only prime numbers.
    $endgroup$
    – James
    54 mins ago












  • $begingroup$
    Yes you're correct
    $endgroup$
    – user644904
    53 mins ago






  • 2




    $begingroup$
    If it was unique to prime numbers, then this would be ground-breaking.
    $endgroup$
    – James
    44 mins ago
















1












$begingroup$

Interesting that you marked 25, which is not a prime, similar to 6x+1 and 6x-1, which means it's not a primality test, but still quite interesting.






share|cite|improve this answer











$endgroup$













  • $begingroup$
    Yeah, but I can't comment (need 50 reputation), so I posted it here.
    $endgroup$
    – James
    1 hour ago










  • $begingroup$
    Its not a primality test
    $endgroup$
    – user644904
    57 mins ago










  • $begingroup$
    I didn't say you meant it to be, I'm just pointing out it's not unique to only prime numbers.
    $endgroup$
    – James
    54 mins ago












  • $begingroup$
    Yes you're correct
    $endgroup$
    – user644904
    53 mins ago






  • 2




    $begingroup$
    If it was unique to prime numbers, then this would be ground-breaking.
    $endgroup$
    – James
    44 mins ago














1












1








1





$begingroup$

Interesting that you marked 25, which is not a prime, similar to 6x+1 and 6x-1, which means it's not a primality test, but still quite interesting.






share|cite|improve this answer











$endgroup$



Interesting that you marked 25, which is not a prime, similar to 6x+1 and 6x-1, which means it's not a primality test, but still quite interesting.







share|cite|improve this answer














share|cite|improve this answer



share|cite|improve this answer








edited 1 hour ago

























answered 1 hour ago









JamesJames

218




218












  • $begingroup$
    Yeah, but I can't comment (need 50 reputation), so I posted it here.
    $endgroup$
    – James
    1 hour ago










  • $begingroup$
    Its not a primality test
    $endgroup$
    – user644904
    57 mins ago










  • $begingroup$
    I didn't say you meant it to be, I'm just pointing out it's not unique to only prime numbers.
    $endgroup$
    – James
    54 mins ago












  • $begingroup$
    Yes you're correct
    $endgroup$
    – user644904
    53 mins ago






  • 2




    $begingroup$
    If it was unique to prime numbers, then this would be ground-breaking.
    $endgroup$
    – James
    44 mins ago


















  • $begingroup$
    Yeah, but I can't comment (need 50 reputation), so I posted it here.
    $endgroup$
    – James
    1 hour ago










  • $begingroup$
    Its not a primality test
    $endgroup$
    – user644904
    57 mins ago










  • $begingroup$
    I didn't say you meant it to be, I'm just pointing out it's not unique to only prime numbers.
    $endgroup$
    – James
    54 mins ago












  • $begingroup$
    Yes you're correct
    $endgroup$
    – user644904
    53 mins ago






  • 2




    $begingroup$
    If it was unique to prime numbers, then this would be ground-breaking.
    $endgroup$
    – James
    44 mins ago
















$begingroup$
Yeah, but I can't comment (need 50 reputation), so I posted it here.
$endgroup$
– James
1 hour ago




$begingroup$
Yeah, but I can't comment (need 50 reputation), so I posted it here.
$endgroup$
– James
1 hour ago












$begingroup$
Its not a primality test
$endgroup$
– user644904
57 mins ago




$begingroup$
Its not a primality test
$endgroup$
– user644904
57 mins ago












$begingroup$
I didn't say you meant it to be, I'm just pointing out it's not unique to only prime numbers.
$endgroup$
– James
54 mins ago






$begingroup$
I didn't say you meant it to be, I'm just pointing out it's not unique to only prime numbers.
$endgroup$
– James
54 mins ago














$begingroup$
Yes you're correct
$endgroup$
– user644904
53 mins ago




$begingroup$
Yes you're correct
$endgroup$
– user644904
53 mins ago




2




2




$begingroup$
If it was unique to prime numbers, then this would be ground-breaking.
$endgroup$
– James
44 mins ago




$begingroup$
If it was unique to prime numbers, then this would be ground-breaking.
$endgroup$
– James
44 mins ago











1












$begingroup$

I had to say, I was suspicious when I read the question but I coded up the problem and up to at least $n=10$ it definitely works.



Edit: I have an idea of how this is working and why it is working. We first prove that our sum can never be divided by $p_i$ for $i$ between $1$ and $n$.



To that end, let's first forget about the modulo $p_1p_2cdots p_n$ term. Note that $q_i$ is not divisible by $p_i$. Moreover, $r_i$ is not divisible by $p_i$ and all the other $q_i$s are divisible by $p_i$. Hence, the sum $r_1q_1 + cdots + r_n q_n$ can never be divisible by $p_i$. Adding a multiple of $p_1cdots p_n$ (which is divisible by $p_i$) doesn't change this fact. Hence, $$r_1 q_1 + cdots + r_n q_nmod (p_1cdots p_n)$$
is at least not divisible by any of the first $n$ primes $p_1$, $p_2$, $dots$ ,$p_n$. Now, the question remains: might it be divisible by $p_{n+1}$ for example? We cannot exclude this, but if we require the sum to be close to $(p_1 p_2cdots p_n)$, it might work!



Now, let's study $x_2$ it seems that we can always make a combination such that $$ r_1 q_1 + cdots + r_n q_n = 1mod (p_1p_2cdots p_n) $$
and it seems that we can always make a combination such that
$$ r_1 q_1 + cdots + r_n q_n = p_{n+1}mod (p_1p_2cdots p_n). $$



Now, under the assumption that above assertion holds, it is not too difficult to finish the proof. So, let $s = r_1 q_1 + cdots + r_n q_nmod (p_1p_2cdots p_n)$ such that $s< p_{n+1}^2$ and let's assume it is composite. We have proven above that $s$ is not divisible by $p_1, p_2, dots, p_n$. This means that the first candidate prime factor is actually $geq p_{n+1}$. However, since $s$ is composite, it has a second prime factor and this also needs to be $geq p_{n+1}$. Thus $sgeq p_{n+1}^2$ which is a contradiction.



The only part that I cannot prove is the existence of certain sequences $(r_1,dots,r_n)$ such that the above congruences hold. I believe it is possible that there exist some fancy number theory that can be applied here to complete this proof. I, just a statistician, can give you the particular combinations up to $n=10$ (they do not seem to follow a certain pattern)



Summarizing I have proven the validity of the assertion in the above under the following assumption. For all $ninmathbb{N}$, there exist sequences $(r_1,dots,r_n)$ and $(r_1',dots,r_n')$ such that
$$ r_1 q_1 + cdots + r_n q_n = 1mod p_1p_2cdots p_n $$
and
$$ r_1' q_1 + cdots + r_n' q_n = p_{n+1}mod p_1p_2cdots p_n. $$






share|cite|improve this answer











$endgroup$













  • $begingroup$
    Thanks for the verification
    $endgroup$
    – user644904
    56 mins ago
















1












$begingroup$

I had to say, I was suspicious when I read the question but I coded up the problem and up to at least $n=10$ it definitely works.



Edit: I have an idea of how this is working and why it is working. We first prove that our sum can never be divided by $p_i$ for $i$ between $1$ and $n$.



To that end, let's first forget about the modulo $p_1p_2cdots p_n$ term. Note that $q_i$ is not divisible by $p_i$. Moreover, $r_i$ is not divisible by $p_i$ and all the other $q_i$s are divisible by $p_i$. Hence, the sum $r_1q_1 + cdots + r_n q_n$ can never be divisible by $p_i$. Adding a multiple of $p_1cdots p_n$ (which is divisible by $p_i$) doesn't change this fact. Hence, $$r_1 q_1 + cdots + r_n q_nmod (p_1cdots p_n)$$
is at least not divisible by any of the first $n$ primes $p_1$, $p_2$, $dots$ ,$p_n$. Now, the question remains: might it be divisible by $p_{n+1}$ for example? We cannot exclude this, but if we require the sum to be close to $(p_1 p_2cdots p_n)$, it might work!



Now, let's study $x_2$ it seems that we can always make a combination such that $$ r_1 q_1 + cdots + r_n q_n = 1mod (p_1p_2cdots p_n) $$
and it seems that we can always make a combination such that
$$ r_1 q_1 + cdots + r_n q_n = p_{n+1}mod (p_1p_2cdots p_n). $$



Now, under the assumption that above assertion holds, it is not too difficult to finish the proof. So, let $s = r_1 q_1 + cdots + r_n q_nmod (p_1p_2cdots p_n)$ such that $s< p_{n+1}^2$ and let's assume it is composite. We have proven above that $s$ is not divisible by $p_1, p_2, dots, p_n$. This means that the first candidate prime factor is actually $geq p_{n+1}$. However, since $s$ is composite, it has a second prime factor and this also needs to be $geq p_{n+1}$. Thus $sgeq p_{n+1}^2$ which is a contradiction.



The only part that I cannot prove is the existence of certain sequences $(r_1,dots,r_n)$ such that the above congruences hold. I believe it is possible that there exist some fancy number theory that can be applied here to complete this proof. I, just a statistician, can give you the particular combinations up to $n=10$ (they do not seem to follow a certain pattern)



Summarizing I have proven the validity of the assertion in the above under the following assumption. For all $ninmathbb{N}$, there exist sequences $(r_1,dots,r_n)$ and $(r_1',dots,r_n')$ such that
$$ r_1 q_1 + cdots + r_n q_n = 1mod p_1p_2cdots p_n $$
and
$$ r_1' q_1 + cdots + r_n' q_n = p_{n+1}mod p_1p_2cdots p_n. $$






share|cite|improve this answer











$endgroup$













  • $begingroup$
    Thanks for the verification
    $endgroup$
    – user644904
    56 mins ago














1












1








1





$begingroup$

I had to say, I was suspicious when I read the question but I coded up the problem and up to at least $n=10$ it definitely works.



Edit: I have an idea of how this is working and why it is working. We first prove that our sum can never be divided by $p_i$ for $i$ between $1$ and $n$.



To that end, let's first forget about the modulo $p_1p_2cdots p_n$ term. Note that $q_i$ is not divisible by $p_i$. Moreover, $r_i$ is not divisible by $p_i$ and all the other $q_i$s are divisible by $p_i$. Hence, the sum $r_1q_1 + cdots + r_n q_n$ can never be divisible by $p_i$. Adding a multiple of $p_1cdots p_n$ (which is divisible by $p_i$) doesn't change this fact. Hence, $$r_1 q_1 + cdots + r_n q_nmod (p_1cdots p_n)$$
is at least not divisible by any of the first $n$ primes $p_1$, $p_2$, $dots$ ,$p_n$. Now, the question remains: might it be divisible by $p_{n+1}$ for example? We cannot exclude this, but if we require the sum to be close to $(p_1 p_2cdots p_n)$, it might work!



Now, let's study $x_2$ it seems that we can always make a combination such that $$ r_1 q_1 + cdots + r_n q_n = 1mod (p_1p_2cdots p_n) $$
and it seems that we can always make a combination such that
$$ r_1 q_1 + cdots + r_n q_n = p_{n+1}mod (p_1p_2cdots p_n). $$



Now, under the assumption that above assertion holds, it is not too difficult to finish the proof. So, let $s = r_1 q_1 + cdots + r_n q_nmod (p_1p_2cdots p_n)$ such that $s< p_{n+1}^2$ and let's assume it is composite. We have proven above that $s$ is not divisible by $p_1, p_2, dots, p_n$. This means that the first candidate prime factor is actually $geq p_{n+1}$. However, since $s$ is composite, it has a second prime factor and this also needs to be $geq p_{n+1}$. Thus $sgeq p_{n+1}^2$ which is a contradiction.



The only part that I cannot prove is the existence of certain sequences $(r_1,dots,r_n)$ such that the above congruences hold. I believe it is possible that there exist some fancy number theory that can be applied here to complete this proof. I, just a statistician, can give you the particular combinations up to $n=10$ (they do not seem to follow a certain pattern)



Summarizing I have proven the validity of the assertion in the above under the following assumption. For all $ninmathbb{N}$, there exist sequences $(r_1,dots,r_n)$ and $(r_1',dots,r_n')$ such that
$$ r_1 q_1 + cdots + r_n q_n = 1mod p_1p_2cdots p_n $$
and
$$ r_1' q_1 + cdots + r_n' q_n = p_{n+1}mod p_1p_2cdots p_n. $$






share|cite|improve this answer











$endgroup$



I had to say, I was suspicious when I read the question but I coded up the problem and up to at least $n=10$ it definitely works.



Edit: I have an idea of how this is working and why it is working. We first prove that our sum can never be divided by $p_i$ for $i$ between $1$ and $n$.



To that end, let's first forget about the modulo $p_1p_2cdots p_n$ term. Note that $q_i$ is not divisible by $p_i$. Moreover, $r_i$ is not divisible by $p_i$ and all the other $q_i$s are divisible by $p_i$. Hence, the sum $r_1q_1 + cdots + r_n q_n$ can never be divisible by $p_i$. Adding a multiple of $p_1cdots p_n$ (which is divisible by $p_i$) doesn't change this fact. Hence, $$r_1 q_1 + cdots + r_n q_nmod (p_1cdots p_n)$$
is at least not divisible by any of the first $n$ primes $p_1$, $p_2$, $dots$ ,$p_n$. Now, the question remains: might it be divisible by $p_{n+1}$ for example? We cannot exclude this, but if we require the sum to be close to $(p_1 p_2cdots p_n)$, it might work!



Now, let's study $x_2$ it seems that we can always make a combination such that $$ r_1 q_1 + cdots + r_n q_n = 1mod (p_1p_2cdots p_n) $$
and it seems that we can always make a combination such that
$$ r_1 q_1 + cdots + r_n q_n = p_{n+1}mod (p_1p_2cdots p_n). $$



Now, under the assumption that above assertion holds, it is not too difficult to finish the proof. So, let $s = r_1 q_1 + cdots + r_n q_nmod (p_1p_2cdots p_n)$ such that $s< p_{n+1}^2$ and let's assume it is composite. We have proven above that $s$ is not divisible by $p_1, p_2, dots, p_n$. This means that the first candidate prime factor is actually $geq p_{n+1}$. However, since $s$ is composite, it has a second prime factor and this also needs to be $geq p_{n+1}$. Thus $sgeq p_{n+1}^2$ which is a contradiction.



The only part that I cannot prove is the existence of certain sequences $(r_1,dots,r_n)$ such that the above congruences hold. I believe it is possible that there exist some fancy number theory that can be applied here to complete this proof. I, just a statistician, can give you the particular combinations up to $n=10$ (they do not seem to follow a certain pattern)



Summarizing I have proven the validity of the assertion in the above under the following assumption. For all $ninmathbb{N}$, there exist sequences $(r_1,dots,r_n)$ and $(r_1',dots,r_n')$ such that
$$ r_1 q_1 + cdots + r_n q_n = 1mod p_1p_2cdots p_n $$
and
$$ r_1' q_1 + cdots + r_n' q_n = p_{n+1}mod p_1p_2cdots p_n. $$







share|cite|improve this answer














share|cite|improve this answer



share|cite|improve this answer








edited 7 mins ago

























answered 1 hour ago









Stan TendijckStan Tendijck

1,541310




1,541310












  • $begingroup$
    Thanks for the verification
    $endgroup$
    – user644904
    56 mins ago


















  • $begingroup$
    Thanks for the verification
    $endgroup$
    – user644904
    56 mins ago
















$begingroup$
Thanks for the verification
$endgroup$
– user644904
56 mins ago




$begingroup$
Thanks for the verification
$endgroup$
– user644904
56 mins ago










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